More from the "In Sorrow Shalt Thou Bring Forth Children" Crowd

[catsittingstill]

Furthering the goals of the "keep women out of jobs and schools" faction:

On June 7th, the anniversary of the Supreme Court decision that gave married people the right to use contraception, the American Life League, along with Pro-Life Wisconsin and Pharmacists for Life International Associate groups want you to join them in protesting in front of facilities that distribute birth control products.  (From Alternet)

That's right, they don't just hate abortions, they hate birth control too.  And if we end up in the same social situation we were in the 1800s,--when a woman couldn't get an education or a decent-paying, well-respected job, because we couldn't ever be alone with a man we weren't related to--why that's not just an unfortunate but necessary side effect of preserving women's purity, but the whole point of the exercise.

Comments

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Gaaaaaaah.

I'm in a private conversation with someone on a music software forum, about the problems they've had because they're blatantly, proudly Christian. I'm doing my best to just run with it, to say I'm Good As Long As No One's Trying To Legislate It and no more, but it's ain't easy, because they're so convinced that They've Found The Answer. The problem is what the hell question is being answered, and until they figure out that question has nothing to do with getting in other peoples' bidness we're never going to get anywhere.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

I'm one of the "don't like abortions? Don't have one" persuasion.

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Oh, definitely on that team. It never occurs to them that their all-powerful Gawd seems to need a lot of help.

[stevemb.livejournal.com]

IMO, part of the reason for the diversion into Iraq is that sustained focus on the actual threat calls attention to the fact that the Christian Right is to the real enemy as the Bunds were to Nazi Germany.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

Nah, these people want to hold a Crusade against the Jihadis. I wish they'd all stop, already.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Yaknow, maybe we should give them the weapons (but not much in the way of support) and let them go over there and duke it out, fundy to fundy. That way we'd eliminate two sources of pestilence at once, and at no cost to our highly-trained, respectable men and women in uniform.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

Me too.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure I follow the argument; the only Bund I can find that might apply was the German American Bund, a pro-Nazi (pre WWII) group in the US. If that's the one you mean, I'd interpret it as "The Christian Right are supporting an external group of similar ideology that is a significant external threat." But I can't figure out what the external group might be, so maybe I'm not following the discussion properly.

[jordan179.livejournal.com]

Indeed, the modern equivalent of the Bunds would be the anti-war activists.

[randwolf.livejournal.com]

Grrrr. But didn't you know?

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

Oh, I knew. I just want to make sure the rest of the world is keeping it firmly in mind.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Over my dead body.... and a whole heaping mountain of spent cartridges.

I hope this ends up like the demonstrations in front of military funerals... i.e. more counterdemonstrators for goodness and light than there are pinheads that think if you don't do it exactly their way you're gonna burn forever (and oh by the way just sign over your paycheck)...

These people are addicted to their religion... they are sick and need professionals... but they'll only respond when they themselves figure out "hey, this just ain't working." Until then? Best to simply isolate them, and when they get in the way, figure out how to embarass the hell out of them. (word choice intentional.) That's probably the fastest way to have'em hit bottom, is to get the entire world pointing and tittering at them.... ?

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

I'd be happy to let them fade into well deserved obscurity at their own pace.

The problem is, in their thrashing, they're likely to drag down *my* rights. That, I'm not so happy about.

[admnaismith.livejournal.com]

Good idea. Too bad they're following their own dogma and bringing forth progeny like rabbits, and doing their pointy-headed best to raise their children to be as ignorant and aggressive as they are.

Ever seen Jesus Camp? Scared the pants offa me.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

Sigh. I've seen Jesus Camp Heck, I've actually gamed with somebody like that. And his two nephews who were just as bad. Not recommended.

[dan-ad-nauseam.livejournal.com]

For some of the anti-choice crowd, going after the Griswold opinion has logic. That was the case that established the constitutional privacy right that was the basis for Roe.

OTOH, there are others who simply fail to accept contraception for religious reasons.

And then there's Randall Terry, who by all accounts is the offspring of a female canine.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

Oh, I can well believe they're going after birth control because it helps their battle against abortion in some way.

[thatcrazycajun.livejournal.com]

>>That's right, they don't just hate abortions, they hate birth control too. <<

The combined emphasis of the soi-disant "pro-life" movement on opposing the availability of both abortion and that which obviates the need for abortions, i.e., birth control, along with their tendency to oppose any government aid to already-born people, has always been the biggest thing that makes me believe their agenda is much less about saving the lives of fetuses (feti?) than about controlling the behavior of adults. It's an attempt to punish "illicit" sexual conduct with mandatory parenthood, and it always sets my teeth on edge.

[hitchkitty.livejournal.com]

The entire "mentality" goes something like this:

Sex is icky. It's disgusting. It's a necessary function for the continuation of families and culture, but it's not nice by any means. Its only proper function is the production of children, and so that should be its only outcome.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

Oh, I think they know sex is fun. I think they just want to make women suffer for it.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

On second thought, I concede the possibility that some of people are so psychologically warped by the social and religious pressures they live under that they have never experienced sex that is fun. I would like to restate my reply as "I think some of them want to make women suffer, but I concede that some of them may not be able to imagine why anyone wants to have sex, and may therefore think that just not having sex is as good an option as any other."

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

It's an attempt to punish "illicit" sexual conduct with mandatory parenthood,

Not just illicit sex. These people oppose birth control for married couples.

(Cat contemplates the crazy for a moment and shakes her head.)

[jordan179.livejournal.com]

And if we end up in the same social situation we were in the 1800s,--when a woman couldn't get an education or a decent-paying, well-respected job, because we couldn't ever be alone with a man we weren't related to--why that's not just an unfortunate but necessary side effect of preserving women's purity, but the whole point of the exercise.

You're overstating both the attitudes of the 19th century and unduly ascribing to malevolence the anti-contraception attitudes of the fundamentalists. Having said that, I think it's really silly to oppose contraception.

[catsittingstill.livejournal.com]

I have had long e-mail conversations with a fundamentalist. And boy, if he wasn't malevolent toward women he certainly did an excellent job of dissimulating.

His claim was that birth control contributed to a "culture of death" and was degrading to women. Seriously.

[stevemb.livejournal.com]

"unduly ascribing to malevolence the anti-contraception attitudes of the fundamentalists"

There are many possible explanations other than malevolence for "I will not use contraception".

There is no possible explanation other than malevolence for "I will attempt to forcibly prevent others from using contraception".

QED.